The Playbook Podcast
2nd Shift Playbook aims to create a community for professional women who are all focused on addressing inequality and creating a community for them to thrive in their professional environments.
It’s not just women’s empowerment. We are focused on women who are in high stress, high performance roles and working to navigate work-life balance.
The Playbook Podcast
Leading with Heart, A Journey from Finance to Disney Exec with Lily Panchasarp
Have you ever found yourself clocking out from your day job only to clock into the 'second shift' at home? We, Dr. Allison Matthews and Charlene Green, tackle the complexities of work-life balance as women, sharing personal insights and celebrating the triumphs of figures like Coco Gauff. In our candid conversation, we unravel the layers of support needed both in professional spaces and at home, and how the energy derived from overcoming doubt and negativity can fuel success.
Our guest, a Dallas native with a compelling career pivot from finance to media, shares her journey to ESPN and the blend of analytical and interpersonal skills that shaped her path. Her candid reflections on leadership, empathy, and self-advocacy illuminate the strategies for combating imposter syndrome and the art of harmonizing personal and professional life. As we navigate through her story, find inspiration in her leap of faith and the importance of leading by example.
Wrapping up this episode, we reflect on the emotive power of sports, the joys of Lake Compounce, and the empowering nature of all-girls schools. We also take a deep dive into maintaining work-life balance amidst today's remote work revolution, breaking cultural myths, and championing diversity in literature and corporate environments. Join us for an episode filled with insights and strategies, as we speak with our esteemed guests on thriving in the multifaceted arena of work and home.
Welcome to Second Shift Playbook, the essential podcast for women navigating the dual demands of professional careers and home responsibilities.
Speaker 2:This show is dedicated to the millions of women who've had to make the tough choice between their careers and caring for their families, and to those who strive daily to balance both.
Speaker 1:In a world where women, especially women of color, in high stress fields like the medical sector and academia, face the daunting challenge of the second shift at home, we're here to offer support guidance and empowerment.
Speaker 2:Our mission is to shine a light on the stories of resilience and determination, to discuss the policies and changes needed to support women fully and to explore how we can all contribute to a more equitable society. Each episode features conversations with trailblazing women like Tia Williams, the best-selling author and beauty editor at Tom Ford, lily Panchasarp, an innovative account executive at Disney.
Speaker 1:Pamela Price, a dedicated deputy director of Baum and Gilead Incorporated, and Michelle Gethers, the visionary chief diversity officer and head of corporate responsibility at Visa.
Speaker 2:These remarkable women share their journeys, the obstacles they've overcome and their strategies for managing the complex interplay of work and home life.
Speaker 1:Second Shift Playbook isn't just a podcast.
Speaker 2:It's a movement towards creating a world where women don't have to choose between their careers and their families.
Speaker 1:As a retired anesthesiologist who has dedicated my career to serving the people of North Carolina through health equity and policy change, I am now committed to advocating for women's empowerment and policies that uplift us all.
Speaker 2:As a PhD in sociology, public health researcher and entrepreneur, I have a deep understanding of stigma and discrimination, emotional intelligence, social psychology and stress management. I've dedicated my career to advocating for marginalized communities to access resources and am now committed to advocating for women to become financially independent and fully empowered to navigate life's challenges. Join us as we delve into the realities, the struggles and the victories of working women everywhere. Together, we can redefine what it means to work and live in harmony, supporting one another through the challenges of the second shift. Welcome to Second Shift Playbook.
Speaker 3:All right. Hello everyone and welcome back to another episode of the Second Shift Playbook. I'm Dr Allison Matthews and I'm here with my colleague, charlene Green. We are so excited to be talking to you about just work-life balance.
Speaker 3:How do women, especially women in professional environments, how do we navigate our lives right? So the kind of premise behind Second Shift is actually a nod to Dr Arlie Hochschild, who's an author who talked about the second shift, about how women work full work days and then, when they get home, they got to do a whole second shift of work, working on your household, working with your families, and, honestly, like I'm a single woman I don't have any children, but I feel like I still have a second shift dealing with my family and with the household and all the other responsibilities. And so we're just got we're here today and you know, with this podcast, to really dive into these topics and find ways together, as women, to navigate these issues. So I'm I'm Dr Allison Matthews. I am, I would like to say, the voice of the liberated Black woman, I like to push the boundaries, I like to be an entrepreneur and I'm a passionate about social justice.
Speaker 1:Charlene. So I yes, I am Charlene Green. I'm a physician, I'm an anesthesiologist, I'm a mom, I'm a wife and I am really interested in how we can get public education back to where it was years ago with subject matter learning. I'm really into environmental justice but, more importantly, I'm into how do we, as women, find that work-life balance that works for us. It's individual at times, but I think collectively we need to work together to have more policies in our infrastructures that is not misogynistic and that is leaning towards equity and what the world is really about Women with, about women with children and women who are excellent at what they do and able to navigate a more flexible lifestyle. Thank you.
Speaker 3:Yeah, so, okay. So what's happening in the news this week or recently that's kind of popping up, related to women, anything that you heard about Charlene?
Speaker 1:Well, the only thing that I've heard about just recently is you know, I've been following that Colorado football team and I know that Deion Sanders is always talking about his daughter as a basketball player. That is one of his rock and solid inspiration. So I'm just always interested in dads who understand their daughters and give them kudos to what they're doing, particularly as an athlete. I think female athletes have sometimes are underrated as regards to their work ethics and what they do, but they work just as hard as the male athletes, particularly the collegiate athletes, and I was just it was on my mind to just say that about the title nine athletes, so yeah.
Speaker 3:That makes me think about Coco Gauff, who yes, yeah, the US Open, open. That's amazing. They said she's the first youngest, uh, winner, I think, since since Serena Williams yeah, yes, so Serena won it at 17.
Speaker 1:I think she won it at 19. But the most profound thing that I thought happened at the US uh, tennisennis Championship was what her speech was about the haters. I don't know if you guys heard that or not. Basically, she said I want to give a shout out to all those people who didn't believe in me and basically the haters that you all thought that I was not going to be anything. And I'm just paraphrasing that somewhat and look where I am now. So I just want to thank you for giving me that fire to push me forward and I just thought that was pretty profound because a lot of times in the workplace, no matter if you're an athlete, if you're in corporate America, if you're a physician, if you're a lawyer, you know you have to, as an African-American woman or a minority, you know work in a space at times where people may, you know, think that you don't deserve to be there or that you don't have the expertise, and that's a really big struggle sometimes for people that may have imposter syndrome.
Speaker 1:So, you know, I just thought that she was speaking for all people when she was just basically saying you know, hey, you know I'm going to persevere, no matter if people don't like me or not. So I thought that was interesting.
Speaker 3:Shout out to all my haters. So yeah, so that actually brings us into our guest for today. We're so excited to bring in Lily Pantusart. Yes, lily's a high school friend of mine. We went to Ursuline Academy together in Dallas, texas, and she has just become a boss in her own right. Worked in sports, worked former ESPN executive and then now working at Disney as an account executive in marketing. So we are just so excited to have you on, lily. Why don't you tell us a little bit about yourself?
Speaker 4:Thank you so much for having me. I love the opening and I was so eager to join in on the conversation. So, yes, I'm Lily Pantresar. I'm now the director of our national sales team, so I lead a few of account executives that are driving revenue for Disney advertising and what that means is we're trying to push our content. So under the Disney portfolio which I know Disney is very large right we have our studios business, we have our parks, experiences and products, and then what my arm in it, arm in the world at Disney, is streaming and media networks. So that's Hulu, espn, abc, Nat G, national Geographic, fx, abc, freeform. So there's a lot of content buckets within my purview and I get to work with marketers, fortune 500 companies, but also the emerging brands as well, that are trying to marry their message and their content into the right audience and into the right environment that can ultimately sell more goods and services. So that's me.
Speaker 4:But I am, as Allison mentioned, a sports fan through and through. I am from Dallas, texas, like Allison. So go, cowboys, our one opener was amazing versus the Giants. So I am a big sports fan and I moved from Dallas to New York just for a big change, and I've been with the Disney company, but under the ESPN umbrella, since 2010. And I've been in sports and now across all of the entertainment.
Speaker 4:So the Cocoa Golf conversation like exactly it's that, it's the that. She said you try to put water on my in, on the fire, to like let me sink, but it actually brought more fuel to me to rise. So she's a great indicator of what again and certainly you were saying about female sports, like what ESPN and the Walt Disney Company is very we want to lean into it. We want to make sure that content is at the forefront, with prime time slots, to make sure that, hey, women's sports, it's dramatic, it's fun, and it's dramatic, it's fun and it's very engaging and advertisers should want to be in that space as well. So, um, sorry, that's a preamble of what I do at yeah but so you were probably.
Speaker 1:You were probably really impressed. You know this is the big news. I may hopefully I'm not getting this wrong but apparently the volleyball team in nebraska nebraska had the highest number of people coming to their volleyball team. So in the past people didn't think that women could bring all these fans to the sports, but that's been such not the correct thing to think about so I was so proud of that. I'm not a real fan of volleyball particularly thing to think about, so I was so proud of that. I'm not a real fan of volleyball particularly, but I just was so happy to see that that number of crowd came to see the volleyball championship.
Speaker 1:I also wanted to just mention something that you said about your company. I love Disney and when I was growing up my family visited Disney a lot and we were in 1970s, probably late 60s, late early 70s. I think we were the only family in our neighborhood that went and stayed at the Polynesian Hotel, which was a big deal in 1970s. So we stayed at the Polynesian Hotel with the trees coming out of the floors. It took me until I was probably about 40 years old to understand that was a big deal for my parents to be able to do that for us and experience that we always stayed at the Polynesian Hotel, took the monorail to the park.
Speaker 1:The Disney experience is real. I just hope that many young children get to experience that you know at least each year, because it's really important to know that you know. Something like that exists in this country and I'm very proud of it. And I'm not saying that because you know we're talking to you, but you know I've been to Disney in Tokyo, oh wow. Talking to you, but you know I've been to Disney in Tokyo, oh wow.
Speaker 4:Real man you are.
Speaker 1:And the Disney in Tokyo is a little bit subdued because the Japanese are a little subdued as well, but that experience is still there. But I like the Disney in Orlando.
Speaker 4:Perfect, I mean Disney. Come to LA. That's where I'm located now, even though I was in New York City for 15 years. But Disneyland is very fun. I will take any and anyone that wants to visit me in LA.
Speaker 1:I've been to Disneyland too. I like Disneyland, but Orlando for me is a little bit of the buzz more.
Speaker 4:It is the biggest one. I get it, you know, to your point on the Polynesian one. I get it, you know, to your point on the Polynesian yes, it's an expensive property, beautiful.
Speaker 4:So, to your point of like, now that you are a parent and seeing what sacrifice that some families do, to go to quote, unquote the magic. It is not lost on us, right Like I want to make sure that you know the socioeconomic, no matter where you are in the spectrum, like how are we making it more accessible and giving it an opportunistic environment for people from everywhere?
Speaker 4:you know, and I think Disney continues to think about that and find finding ways to make sure that you can experience the quote unquote magic in different parts of our portfolio, right? So hey, you can't go to Disney World or Disneyland, but we might have pop-up experiences here or there. Or why we have Disney Plus as a streaming service to make sure our content is there and accessible more to the masses, and now globally. So I know Bob Iger and team definitely are thinking in that way.
Speaker 1:And so we'll definitely have to have you come back, because I want to know more details about the inner workings of how do you get that behind the scenes and those apartments that the really rich celebrities get to stay in and those apartments that the really rich celebrities get to stay in, and as well as how do we book the magic kingdom for ourselves and nobody else can get in there, right? So maybe next time we can talk more about the inner workings of Disney and how the average person may can win a lottery for that.
Speaker 4:The tip and tricks is always a thing that I get asked yes, yes, awesome Allison, you go ahead so I'm just curious but um, how did you get into the work that you're doing now?
Speaker 4:great question. So, yeah, being born and raised in Dallas, I also went to SMU and, like media wasn't anything I could even think of as a career. So I was. I graduated my degree in finance. So in my head I was like, okay, I need to be a trader or financial analyst somewhere.
Speaker 4:And you know, my parents immigrated from Thailand. So that mentality of my parents, to be honest, probably have no idea what I still do. Right, they just know I make money and I'm okay. But in my head when I was going through college, it was just like I need to be a business person and that's an entrepreneur, that's what my father is and I think having a background in finance is what I needed. I remember my junior year of college being like I don't enjoy it, like I am I probably do have a math mindset, like more analytical in that manner but I didn't enjoy it but nonetheless kept going, cause I was like I need to make my parents proud and I need to be able to to just afford a lifestyle. So after college, with a finance degree, I was like I need to move. I want to move to New York City. Born and bred in Dallas, love it enough, but I needed to get out of Texas.
Speaker 4:It's like you know, needed some additional life experiences. So I looked at jobs and I became a financial analyst at first. That's what got me to New York City for Spiegel Brands it's actually a fashion company and I reported into the CFO and I did that for a year and I liked it and it was fine. But it didn't get to flex my interpersonal skills. I knew that I was able to do reports or things in the planning phase of that industry, but it wasn't enjoyable to me. So what I had to take at 22, rethink what I needed and how I can live a lifestyle in New York City.
Speaker 4:So I budgeted and, okay, lily, this is what I can do, this is what I can make. But what makes me happy and that's sports, and who is the great leader in sports is ESPN. So when I went online and I honestly looked at different roles Bristol, connecticut, is where our headquarters is, very, very far me in town, like very small, I would not thrive there. But then there was an arm of back in the day used to be called customer marketing and sales and that was a division which now I'm in in New York City and it was their media arm which is working with advertisers with the ESPN content. So I did the blanket apply online, which I know and I tell people early on their career right Like networking is key, but also always shoot your shot. You never know what's going to happen right.
Speaker 4:I put it out there. I put I applied online. I had an interesting weird, like you know, people usually are English majors, communications, advertising majors, but at a finance background there, and I had like two years of work experience by this time and I taught. I just put it out there in the world. And then I met someone, responded to me online. But then I was at my, I was working out at my gym.
Speaker 4:I met another female who was like a d1 athlete. She was a tennis player for Syracuse and we just hit it off because we athlete. She was a tennis player for Syracuse and we just hit it off because we liked the sports environment or like that kind of training. And she was like I moved from Bristol, connecticut, to New York City and I was like, wow, I just applied and just combined, putting things out there and saying my passion from sports, but just being open to hearing what kind of jobs are out there I want. When the recruiter reach back out to me they're like I don't have a job for you right now, but do you want to do an informational meet interview with this team? That's, you know more on our linear network network at that time, just ESPN, espn2. And I went for the interview and a week later they're like I have an opening, I think you'd be great for this job. So I took at that point a pay cut in my career but I was like it's ESPN, I'm going to do it Right.
Speaker 4:I did negotiate because you know, as women and what we're talking about, it's we need to valid, like, know our self-worth and know that career. But where I'm at now, I definitely always tell people to advocate for themselves, especially women, women of color. Like I suffer from imposter syndrome. I honestly feel like sometimes like, how did I get here? Or why am I here? Like, is it because this other mentor of mine that's honestly a lot of white men in our industry, especially at ESPN, got me into the places I did and I need to have my brain rewired, of? No, I got here because of me, you know, and so sorry, I got into the industry that way. It's like blind luck of hey, just what do I? What makes me happy, what am I passionate about? Identify it and just kind of go for it. And I then landed into media because of that and I haven't looked back because I didn't realize how much it does marry my interpersonal skills, my analytical skills, and I guess I'm good at it because I've been in it.
Speaker 1:I love it. So I got a few questions to ask you. One of which I'm going to ask you is what is your leadership style and how do you bring the people that you work with as being a mentor for them as well?
Speaker 4:Love that question. I lead by example. It's my number one thing I don't realize. I you know there's nothing big or small that I won't do, right, and I try to inform that to my team as well. To be like, hey, I number one. I care, I am an empathetic leader.
Speaker 4:I do, when we were all talking about the second shift, like what are you, how do you balance life? Like I'm a leader that wants to, for better, for worse. I want to know all about what make, all about what motivates you, what boundaries you need to put into place and how can I help in the end of the day, right? So I do lead in my work ethic in that way, and I think a lot of we're doing end of year review right now, which is funny.
Speaker 4:I just had my team submit these four buckets and then I have to respond and see how they performed this past year. And one of them for people, managers like myself they asked like what is like, how do you think you did this past year of leading your team? And so I I do say lead by example, and it's just like making sure I'm asking the right or probing, just so they feel comfortable in sharing everything that makes them tick or or motivate, like from both sides of the coin, to make sure that I'm, I feel that they can trust me and they're, they're to bring me on on their journey of life and not just work so awesome and my second question is um well, I actually got really two real quickly.
Speaker 1:Um one is let me, let me just skip to the real good deal. Like I love get up on espn let me just say that right.
Speaker 1:So so I think you guys do a good job, meaning Disney does a good job, with that show. It's a little interesting sometimes I was post-called today, meaning I worked last night so I was able to watch it a little bit. And when I saw the Greenberg guy start almost crying about Aaron Rodgers I was like, oh my gosh, this is real about his Achilles injury. And then RG three was they were fighting with another you know co-hosts on there about Aaron Rogers. I thought it was funny about how they need them. You know the the team needs to find a new quarterback. I thought it was really interesting. But I liked the dynamics of just a free flow of ideas that happens with that show. So I just want to give a shout out to that from Disney. To be honest with you Appreciate it.
Speaker 1:Yes, but I also want to ask you something quickly. You mentioned Bristol, connecticut. You know the oldest kind of amusement park is that Compounds place.
Speaker 4:Say Compounds yeah right.
Speaker 3:We go there.
Speaker 1:Yeah, how does Disney feel about that? I mean, is that that's not? That's not owned by Disney, of course. So I think it was big back in 1846 or something long, long time ago. How does it still exist? Right, that's the question. So what is it?
Speaker 4:It's an amusement park. It's an amusement park, it's an amusement park and it's funny that she knows about like, like. So we have our espn the picnic, which is like a company, like off-site. It's always like the last week of august before back to school and we close it out. I don't know. So I'm sorry I can't really answer your question, but I don't know much about it.
Speaker 1:It's still, I guess, for Connecticut, like residents to enjoy some kind of theme park, but yeah, Well, my son went to Endicott for a minute, so I know I had to research a lot of stuff in that area. You know, Endicott is about 20 miles out of Boston, so you guys are about a hundred miles out of Boston. So it's almost like in that area of the country to Northeast everything is so close so you get to figure out like what's, what's, what's all around this whole place, Right? So? But my last question is and I don't mean to hog up all the questions is like I think, if I'm saying this correctly, you and Dr Matthews went to all girls high school, correct, Correct?
Speaker 1:Yes, so I did too. And when you said finance, I said I think it's interesting at times that when women go to all girls high schools they get that confidence in math, because not all women get that confidence, but I know I had that. How do you think you got that confidence in math that you could own it and that you were good at it? Do you think it helped to go to all girls school?
Speaker 4:Definitely I feel Ursuline was in. Looking back now, I thoroughly appreciate that that form, those formative four years, really was the crux of how I am as a person today and I feel like all my quote-unquote sisters from that school, they're doing phenomenal things and they're wanting to give back to their community and doing just a lot more. And I know that you're asking about the math question, but I think just I can't give any more like shout out and love to what Ursuline did for me From a math standpoint. I think, honestly, honestly, since my family speaks Thai, like math it was like a common, it's another language, right, and I, my parents, my dad owned a jewelry business and I had to work with him counting money.
Speaker 4:So I think math was always in my vein but like English, wasn't really good because you know, we were we my oldest brother and one of five kids. He almost got pulled into ESL because and then my dad was like, okay, we need to start speaking English in this household. So me being the youngest, my tie is not as good as my brother. But I think, just by default, math just started to excel in my brain because I know that's where my parents were able to. You know, help me and kind of lean into it, but I definitely think Ursuline was. You know that they're a math and science, but I do think they formed us into strong people and individuals and so I'm forever grateful.
Speaker 3:I think the other unique thing about all girls schools, and I guess Ursuline in particular, was the fact that we didn't have to compete against boys. Like it was just us, like we didn't, we weren't even worried about boys, like you know, in in the classroom at least. Like you weren't, you didn't have to. Like I feel like I've heard from women who've attended co-ed schools that the boys got more attention, they got called on more, they were like encouraged more to pursue science and math, whereas at Ursuline, like I wasn't necessarily in the math track but I was more in the science track and I really enjoyed. Like I was encouraged to pursue a career in medicine, I was encouraged to pursue science and in medicine, I was encouraged to pursue science and and things like that, whereas I don't know if I would have been pulled to the side like that if I were at a co-ed school. So I just feel like, yeah, all girls is just like I. I'm a proponent for going to for, for a single sex or same-sex schools when you're younger, just because of that.
Speaker 1:So I agree with that. I know that Nicole Hannah-Jones said that too. I think she went to our girls' high school at least. So yeah, I just want to say that I think that confidence in math is really important. So when kids go to a co-ed school, I think we need to let girls know when you, when kids go to a co-ed school, I think we need to let girls know you know how to get that confidence, cause many times the teachers don't, you know, give them that confidence in math. So I just want to make that point. But, yeah, awesome. My question to you is how do you? What does work-life balance? What does work-life balance mean to you?
Speaker 4:It's a great question, I know. Coming off the heels of the life after COVID is even more important and a lot of talk we talk about as leaders too and to try and figure out what that is accountability and also being able to be flexible as an employer to that. So for me personally, work-life balance very important to me, right, like I do, as Allison mentioned, I'm a single. I don't have children, I'm not looking to have children, so I made that point in lifestyle, more vocal about it in the workplace, because I do. But that means that I lean so forward on parents male or female, to be honest that I want them to be able to have a true work-life balance with their children and their family space and then also working For me. Since I need to work on work-life balance a little bit more, I do, I am, I work a lot. I think COVID helped me tremendously to reset and, candidly, I had to move out of New York, right, I think I was working a lot because there is no off button in New York city, but in LA I am much happier and, I think, more balanced.
Speaker 4:I know that I'm still a person I don't know if y'all have this, but I have two phones. I have a work phone and the only way to put myself account, like from a boundary, is like having that work phone still so I can leave it and then, like, go do my stuff. What sets me from I'm a very routine person too I my outlet is work. To work out Like I need an hour out of my day to make sure that's my time. And since I do work New York hours sometimes like I'm on calls at 6am at times I can, but then that gives me the afternoon to be more flexible. So I always say, like your day and your work-life balance does not need to look like your next colleague right, and I every year and I'm about to do this again for my team specifically I have a exercise of right. Like what motivates you, what are your personal time slots Like? So everyone in our team knows this and mine I am flexible, but it is an hour out of maybe even what you call a traditional nine to six workspace that I need to go do something as a release, and that's usually a workout.
Speaker 4:And then what we talked about at the very beginning, what Allison honestly mentioned, like yes, I don't have children, I'm an aunt of five children and I call them my kids, and my best friends have children and I'm a very quality time, is my love language. So my boundary, like I will make time, like whatever they need drop of a dime, like I will either fly or I'll be somewhere because I want to make sure that I'm present. So, while I don't have a physical child or a human to, and that's why I highly respect and thank that women that are in the workforce, that are working moms, like y'all, are special humans. So whatever I can do to make your work-life balance better, I'm gonna do that and I have three people on my team that are parents, right, and I make sure that I give them the flexibility and I get good responses. So at least I'm doing something right, I hope.
Speaker 4:But I wanna make sure that a work-life balance and mental health, to be honest, is very important to me. A lot of my friends are in that line of work. I was just in Sausalito. My best friend got her PhD psychology and I felt like I was. I was like, wow, I'm at a good wellness retreat, like people are, you know. It's like maybe psychoanalyzing me, but I'm, I'm all for it. So I want to make sure that my team has that and I cause I do look at work-life balance as like the number one thing that people don't realize there's actually monetary like alignment to it right. Like when you're looking at another job and you're like I'm not getting this and I just need to quit because I need a promotion from a title. But I'm like is your work-life balance right now good? Like does your manager or whoever your boss is, is giving you that flexibility? Like that is worth a lot of money and you might not see it in your paycheck, but your mental wellbeing is, and thanks you for that.
Speaker 3:And right now.
Speaker 4:I say that I have the best work-life balance because of my boss right now and I'm better at creating boundaries. I won't take a six-day meeting for just anybody. Like it has to be a client. You know what I mean. Like you know I okay, I do realize I am at a level where I am able to do that. But I do tell my team hey, you should have your boundaries too. And if it's an internal meeting and you're sitting in LA, you're trying to talk to a New York team member, just say no, you know, like.
Speaker 1:So I I do try and push the team to think that way as well and I'm not gonna so we, we definitely have to have a part two of this because I want to mention from my experience of 29 years of experience working as a physician with mostly males is that that balance sometimes of being a woman that is single with no kids, sometimes the workplace men may take work at times because they don't mention that their wives cook, clean and do a lot of things that maybe you know we have to do for ourselves, no matter if we're married or not.
Speaker 1:So they get a lot of perks too of being married where we don't as much. So sometimes you know they can put us on these tasks, these tenuous tasks sometimes that they say, because you're not married or you don't have kids, that you're doing tasks that maybe they wouldn't do even if they weren't married. So I just want to make that point from my experience. You know like, hey, you take that 24 hour call, I got to put my kids to bed, but they don't put their kids to bed anyway. You know. I just want to mention that. The second thing I want to mention is I don't know there's there's a wonderful author that came out with with a book about the myth of some when she was growing up, the myth of I think I'm not sure if this particular author was Chinese or, but definitely an immigrant of how that myth of that you have to be the American dream and you can't. You got to be perfect.
Speaker 1:And sometimes that can cause stresses for some families what that book was. Because I think you know, a lot of times people when they're growing up, they sometimes don't embrace their culture and they feel as though they can't. But I think this space now and the where we are now, I think people can embrace their culture, be successful and not have any pause about trying to keep things secret about like their families or their food or their cultures. For instance, this young author well, she's not young, but was basically saying that her mom cooked good food but she couldn't bring the food to school because she was going to get teased. I mean, all those things are in the past. It's not in the future anymore, and I think celebrating your culture in your language is very important to many people now in your language is very important to many people now, and I think I guess my question to you is how do we celebrate that more with people of different, diverse backgrounds, ethnicities, languages? How do we accept people for who they are in their brilliance?
Speaker 4:Yes, yeah, and that you I don't know specifically that book, but that definitely that's me too. Right, like my mom was. Right, she didn't work but she raised five children to being like, hey, you need hot food. So she would drop off my lunch Monday through Friday, and I was.
Speaker 4:I did not love the smell of the noodles or the curry or the rice, because I'm like, oh man, and I, I, I think the next generation normalizing, right, Like it's our parent, we're at a I'm at like almost 40, right, so it's like the generation of trying to bridge the gap of being an American, but also my parents being Thai and now a lot of things, there's not that many immigrants coming, but I think we were the generation to be like, okay, I might've shied away from being this minority or being not American, but now I'm so proud, right Like now it's like I'm so glad these stories are being told.
Speaker 4:It's being definitely celebrated, but not celebrated enough. So I think we could we're there at the edge, but we could keep pushing ourselves forward and I know from my side, especially in the workforce, like women at ESPN, first of all, there was I'm going to go way back Well, not way back for whoever's listening in 2012,. Jeremy Lin went off right Lin, sanity was a thing, and that was in 2012. And right, and one of our anchors said, wrote a mobile article which a lot at that time people weren't consuming mobile content, and it was like, oh, is there a chink in the armor?
Speaker 3:Oh, wow, and yes.
Speaker 4:So they were like, oh, this is a funny play on words. And we're like, okay now, you like, at that point, I think Asians specifically right, more submissive. And we're like, okay now, you like, at that point, I think Asians specifically right, more submissive. And we don't say anything, we're like going to let it roll. But I was proud of, you know, the work for, like, the Asian community coming for me, Like that's not right, that's a derogatory term, like we don't like and someone needs to be held accountable. That writer did get terminated, but then there was a news anchor that kind of repeated that headline and that was on the New York platform on ESPN. They ended up being don't quote me, but something, maybe probation, but his whole thing was like, oh, my wife's Asian, you know, like it's okay, like you know to do, know to do this.
Speaker 4:It's not okay not good, I remember out and when our organization didn't know what to do, they brought all the Asian workers or Asian descent, and there was five of us. We came together and there was only three women and like two men in this room and the guy, the man, the Oliver Dizon, I remember he was a Filipino background and he was the highest minority there and was like I'm sorry, like I want you to feel. I just looked around the room and I was like what is going? This is it? Like representation does matter? And I knew at that point like yes, I was early on.
Speaker 4:I was only at ESPN at that time for two years. I was like probably in my mid, early twenties, and then I also felt bad, cause I was like should I be more vocal? Should I be? Am I like I'm offended, but like I didn't want to say anything and I just want to be like oh, it's okay. So I kind of went on a preamble but like that's just to say of hey, things are changing and what I'm trying to do, like bridging the, the gap of hey, let's be proud of each one of our individuality, from any kind of lifestyle that we lead, it doesn't have the racial, doesn't, you know, like your preference in totality, like I am part of our D and I efforts, I am part of lead as, like the inclusion group for the entire Walt Disney company, so not just my arm.
Speaker 4:So I try to make sure that I people can see that we even, as a lot of Asian women do the imposter syndrome that I kind of mentioned like we're vocal too, we're going to act, we're hard workers and I know a lot of people are across the board, but we want to give everyone the opportunity and I was selected to do this one large, like it's called, our tech and data showcase, and someone did say, you know, highlighted that oh, wow, we have women, or and yes, I was of a minority, and in my head for a second I was like, did I get selected because I'm an Asian female leader in our organization? And then I paused. But at the end of the day, I don't care. I know I want to make sure that people see these career-oriented, work-life balance, people that care in leadership positions and if that's the form, if they tap me in because of that, fine, but I know that I can back it up too, because I work hard and I know what I'm talking about.
Speaker 4:So I think it's I'm excited for the next generation, right, like all the things that we had to do to. It's a crazy time, like the working five days a week and you know the lack of conversations of mental health, the lack of care and awareness about someone's different background. But now we're here and you know people are like, oh, are we do we lean too forward? Like are we too? I'm like lean that way and then like let's course correct, because we have so many issues that we had like generations and decades of things that weren't right that we need to to talk about and continue to lead in that way.
Speaker 3:So you said so many things that have resonated with me and I'm just trying to think of. I don't want to forget everything, but I let me go back to the lunch example. I remember going to middle school and high school and like my mom would pack gumbo for me and, like you know, traditional kind of African-American meals, and I was also embarrassed, you know, I wanted to be like everybody else and just eat the school lunch. And then now I'm like I was eating good food.
Speaker 4:I was like my mom loved me actually.
Speaker 3:My mom loved me and I think also you also realize that some of those kids wish their mom would do that. But but then we were just so caught up in being minorities and wanting to fit in and, to quote unquote, assimilate that we didn't, that we saw it as an as a bad thing, as a stigma, and we were embarrassed by it. But you know, and then what also resonated with me was you talking about, you know, just doing DEI stuff. Right Like that. I'm curious, do you get paid extra for that? Right Like, wait, we are expected to do our full-time jobs and then volunteer to do all this stuff to like make sure that the company is, you know, is reflecting our experiences, but oftentimes we don't get compensated for that. So that is a type of second shift, also right Like it's a minority second shift, that, like, we have to constantly and I think it's important, right Like, we do it because we care and we know it's important, but it's also an extra burden that other communities don't have to bear or they choose not to, right.
Speaker 4:So, I mean it just resonates. I never thought about that, allison.
Speaker 3:Yeah. I just feel like in academia, we're always asked to be on all the DEI committees and to mentor all the minority students and you know and like, we're supposed to be in charge of those things, right, and to a certain extent, I think we should be right. We're supposed to be, we're supposed to be in charge of those things. Right, and and and to a certain extent I think we should be right because we are the ones who had those experiences, but we are not compensated for those things.
Speaker 4:Absolutely.
Speaker 1:I've got one even better for you guys. So, okay, you're a financial analyst, perfect person, right? So you go to a meeting in New York City and because you are of color, that's DEI. No, you're just an expert that happens to be of color. That's not like DEI. I'm like so sort of like. You know, I've been at medical meetings where they have a person of color and they're like oh, we have diversity. No, you just have an expert that happens to be of color. That's not dei. I just think the definition of dei has just gotten out of control and I think it's pretty interesting. But the last question I want to ask is one of my favorite books is about john dore. Um, measure what matters about the okay arts. I was wondering do you guys use that in your Disney work?
Speaker 4:We don't, we and we should and hey, I love reading. Send me any books. I could ask my team to read the books. Funny, we just got Iger sent us the Steve Jobs book right and about his work, about his work style, which is really interesting.
Speaker 4:Yeah, it's interesting, I need to read it. Yeah, and even the Bob Iger book was good, like I, but a lot of it, I'm sorry. I'm going to go back to white men, like let's talk about other people that are in areas of true success stories, that resident, like I do think now combining a lot of like with Hulu and through our mergers and acquisitions from a gender or like women and men right now that I'm seeing it is pretty even 50, 50, but it can be better, right, and especially within our minority groups and other, just when we're looking at all D&I, I think it could be better. So I think any books you have do you recommend Absolutely, I would totally bring to the team because I think we do need to. No-transcript.